“Beginner Technical” and “Escalante” do not go well together. There are very few rappelling type canyons in the Escalante that do not require advanced canyoneering skills such as downclimbing, marginal anchor assessment, and advanced natural anchor building. In a way, the Escalante is a “traditional canyoneering” reserve area, and the appearance of drilled anchors would be met with dismay (at least) by many people.
Perhaps the only exception to this would be Neon, where bolts go in and get chopped on a regular basis. Be sure to bring a 40′ length of rope to tie off the boulder pinch-thing at the end, ’cause its more natural than leaving behind 2 – 3/8″ x 2-1/2″ pieces of metal.
But there are many wonderful slots to do in Escalante that do not require ropes and stuff, but make good use of your climbing skills. Check out Steve’s descriptions of Upper Spooky and those things. You’d probably find Egypt 3 entertaining as well, and you can bring a rope (and tie it off to the arch) to do the last little bit.
Tom
rcornia@visto.com wrote:
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner technical canyons > in > Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good? Choprock? What > canyons do you recommend for people with some canyoneering and > climbing experience who want to err on the safe side? (ie- no 300 > foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of potholes, or setting > anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am looking for some > relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association > http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? > Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you > must visit the web site to view messages. >
Joe Wrona
Everybody has their own preference for rope, and there is no single “right” rope to use. Ropes don’t break from dead weight, they sever from being chopped or sawn through. Therefore, far more important than the diameter of your rope is your ability to descend SMOOTHLY and with no lateral movement of the rope over any sharp surface. Extend your anchor systems over sharp edges, or use buffers to soften edges (like your shirt or shorts or a piece of leather that you have brought along for that purpose).
Also, if you are pioneering and there is a possibility that someone may have to conduct belayed climbing, be aware that static line can and will injure or kill you even in very short fall situations (like 8 feet). It is not the fall that kills you, it is the sudden STOP that does it. This is not an issue in the trade route slot country of Zion and the San Raphael; but it is worth bearing in mind if you are pioneering routes in harder areas.
The downside to fall rated climbing rope is that some folks have a hard time keeping their descents smooth and the resulting “bounce” can chop or saw through a mantle pretty quickly. Hence, static line is a good choice for basic “rap ‘n swim” canyons like Heaps, Imlay, West, Neon, etc.
As for static line, I’ve used 7mm lots of time, and on exploratory trips on the Colorado Plateau I usually take one or two 165′ lengths of 7mm, two tiblocs, a swami, 25′ of 1/2″ tubular with a couple of rap rings, and two 3mm cordelletes. This gear has never held me back, although I have retreated for other reasons!
Having said that, I wouldn’t take responsibility for forcing someone else to rely exlcusively on 7mm descent ropes on a trip, and it is definitely a mistake to send novices down on 7mm line. Neophytes spend too much time dicking around while on a weighted rope, and they tend to engage in a lot of lateral movement while descending. Same is true for ascending. On a trip about a year ago, one of my partners (who had hundreds of wilderness slot descents to his credit but no jugging experience) was struggling during a 125′ free hanging jug of an 11mm climbing rope out of Clearwater Canyon in the Cataract Canyon area. His spinning ascent rotated the mantle of the rope around a sharp edge and severed the mantle (We had him on a TR for that very reason).
The new ropes with double tough mantles make very good slot ropes for this very reason. Dry ropes are nice too. Aramid 8mm is a pretty good product.
If you are just trying to obtain basic perlon static cord, you can pick it up in whatever length you desire from your local outdoor shop. If you go this route, watch for when your rope mantle starts to waltz off the ends of your lines. It can migrate several feet in one trip, so keep cutting it off and resealing your ends.
Most Escalante canyons go with a single 150′ line (or less); if you take two lines you are stylin’. A good Escalante Wingate rig is to have one 150′ and one 50′. Use the shorty for most of the drops and as a handline if anyone is struggling with the minor obstacles that pop up from time to time. Take 100′ or so of webbing (brown or grey is nice!) and some rap rings to rig your anchors.
Oh yeah, it is not a good idea to mix your canyoneering ropes with your active climbing ropes. Too much goop gets into a slot rope to trust it to a sport that contemplates high energy falls.
Anyway, that is probably enough spray for now.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > Joe; or anyone, you’ve been so helpful so far, can I > pick your brains one > more time? This concerns rope. I have a 50 and 60 > meter climbing ropes, and > a 200 ft length of 7/16″ static rope. All of these > seem like overkill, so I > investigated the availability of smaller static > ropes. It turns out Blue > Water makes both an 8mm and 9.5 mm static rope, but > when I went to place an > order, I was told that they only sell 300 ft. > minimum for the 9.5, and 450 > ft. for the 8 mm. I figure I don’t need more than > 100 ft. at most for this > trip. Do you know of any sources for this quantity > of rope? Which would be > better? Can I get by with 8mm? Thanx again for your > help. st
—–Original Message—– > From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 4:31 PM > To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
The REI sox are good, and the Raidrunners are very > good. (Carl Hammer, a very good Zion canyoneer, uses > them for speed descents). > — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
Thanx again Joe. I have REI gore-tex sox, which,
when I bought them, fit
better than the sealskins. I did have my eye on a
pair of shoes made by
Salomon, similar to trail runners, but a little
heavier(named “Raid”). They
look like the way to go. We did stop at Escalante
Outfitters a couple years
ago, and they do have the best pizza in s.
Utah(maybe n. Arizona too!). I
really appreciate your input. st
—–Original Message—–
From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 3:58 PM
To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in
Escalante?
Shoes aren’t as important as “sealskins” for your
trip. Everybody recommends hiking boots, and > their
reasons are good (ankle support, etc.), but I > always
wear trail running shoes because they feel lighter
when wet and they dry out much quicker.
Sealskins are a kind of waterproof sock. They
aren’t
really waterproof, but they stop the FLOW of ice
cold
water through your feet. It is far more > comfortable
(and safer!!!) when your feet don’t feel like > blocks
of ice. I get ’em at REI, but I imagine that they
are
everywhere. Believe me, these things are worth
their
weight in gold on a cold water descent.
I’ve never used a wetsuit in Death Hollow, but it
should help you out on a November descent.
Good job for doing that canyon during quite time.
Please stop in and see my friends Barry and > Celeste
at
the Escalante Outfitters. Barry makes the best
pizza
in southern Utah and Celeste pours a great > Cutthroat
pale ale. They also keep their ears open for
conditions in the canyons.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
> Thanx Joe. I have been informed about some > noxious
> weed in the vicinity,
> could it be poison ivy? I will stay alert. Just
> bought a wetsuit(4/3). Shoes
> next. Any thoughts on canyoneering shoes? I have
> hiking and mountaineering
> boots, rock climbing shoes, bowling shoes,
softball
> cleats, but I’m not sure
> what would be appropriate for this type of trip.
Did
> you say something about
> poison ivy? thanx again. st
—–Original Message—–
> From: Joe Wrona > [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 12:55 PM
> To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch
out
> for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you > have
a
> dry bag at night is going to be critical, given
the
> 11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered
this
> already, but be prepared for cold water and no > sun
> for
> most of the day. You are going at a great time > of
> year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t
> underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow
in
> the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly
> Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than > the
> main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for
poison
> ivy? The very best canyon in that part of
Escalante
> is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by > the
> mail
> trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the > nicest
> slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death
Hollow
> on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way,
> mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, > heads
> Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd
class
> in
> difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste
> your
> time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going > in
> from the top or if you are going in from below.
> There
> is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from > the
> south rim just below Death Hollow if you are > going
> up
> from the bottom.
> — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in
Escalante the first of
November. Don’t know if this is beginner > stuff,
> but
it does sound
interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I
> think).
—–Original Message—–
From: rcornia@visto.com [mailto:rcornia@visto.com]
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM
To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in
Escalante?
I was curious what everyone’s favorite > beginner
technical canyons
in
Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly > good?
Choprock? What
canyons do you recommend for people with some
canyoneering and
climbing experience who want to err on the > safe
side? (ie- no 300
foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out > of > === message truncated ===
Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Todd, Steve
Joe; or anyone, you’ve been so helpful so far, can I pick your brains one more time? This concerns rope. I have a 50 and 60 meter climbing ropes, and a 200 ft length of 7/16″ static rope. All of these seem like overkill, so I investigated the availability of smaller static ropes. It turns out Blue Water makes both an 8mm and 9.5 mm static rope, but when I went to place an order, I was told that they only sell 300 ft. minimum for the 9.5, and 450 ft. for the 8 mm. I figure I don’t need more than 100 ft. at most for this trip. Do you know of any sources for this quantity of rope? Which would be better? Can I get by with 8mm? Thanx again for your help. st
—–Original Message—– From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 4:31 PM To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
The REI sox are good, and the Raidrunners are very good. (Carl Hammer, a very good Zion canyoneer, uses them for speed descents). — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > Thanx again Joe. I have REI gore-tex sox, which, > when I bought them, fit > better than the sealskins. I did have my eye on a > pair of shoes made by > Salomon, similar to trail runners, but a little > heavier(named “Raid”). They > look like the way to go. We did stop at Escalante > Outfitters a couple years > ago, and they do have the best pizza in s. > Utah(maybe n. Arizona too!). I > really appreciate your input. st
—–Original Message—– > From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 3:58 PM > To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
Shoes aren’t as important as “sealskins” for your > trip. Everybody recommends hiking boots, and their > reasons are good (ankle support, etc.), but I always > wear trail running shoes because they feel lighter > when wet and they dry out much quicker.
Sealskins are a kind of waterproof sock. They > aren’t > really waterproof, but they stop the FLOW of ice > cold > water through your feet. It is far more comfortable > (and safer!!!) when your feet don’t feel like blocks > of ice. I get ’em at REI, but I imagine that they > are > everywhere. Believe me, these things are worth > their > weight in gold on a cold water descent.
I’ve never used a wetsuit in Death Hollow, but it > should help you out on a November descent.
Good job for doing that canyon during quite time. > Please stop in and see my friends Barry and Celeste > at > the Escalante Outfitters. Barry makes the best > pizza > in southern Utah and Celeste pours a great Cutthroat > pale ale. They also keep their ears open for > conditions in the canyons.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
Thanx Joe. I have been informed about some noxious
weed in the vicinity,
could it be poison ivy? I will stay alert. Just
bought a wetsuit(4/3). Shoes
next. Any thoughts on canyoneering shoes? I have
hiking and mountaineering
boots, rock climbing shoes, bowling shoes, > softball
cleats, but I’m not sure
what would be appropriate for this type of trip. > Did
you say something about
poison ivy? thanx again. st
—–Original Message—–
From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 12:55 PM
To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in
Escalante?
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch > out
for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you have > a
dry bag at night is going to be critical, given > the
11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered > this
already, but be prepared for cold water and no sun
for
most of the day. You are going at a great time of
year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t
underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow > in
the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly
Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than the
main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for > poison
ivy? The very best canyon in that part of > Escalante
is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by the
mail
trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the nicest
slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death > Hollow
on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way,
mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, heads
Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd > class
in
difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste
your
time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going in
from the top or if you are going in from below.
There
is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from the
south rim just below Death Hollow if you are going
up
from the bottom.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
> A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in
> Escalante the first of
> November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff,
but
> it does sound
> interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I
think).
—–Original Message—–
> From: rcornia@visto.comrcornia@visto.com]
> Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM
> To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner
> technical canyons
> in
> Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good?
> Choprock? What
> canyons do you recommend for people with some
> canyoneering and
> climbing experience who want to err on the safe
> side? (ie- no 300
> foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of
> potholes, or setting
> anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am
looking
> for some
> relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering > Association
> http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group?
> Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email
> to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you
> must visit the web site to view messages.
Mail – Free email you can access from
anywhere!
http://mail.yahoo.com/
> Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association
http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group?
Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email
to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you
must visit the web site to view messages.
> > > Mail – Free email you can access from > anywhere! > http://mail.yahoo.com/
=== message truncated ===
Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association http://www.canyoneering.net
Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you must visit the web site to view messages.
Joe Wrona
The REI sox are good, and the Raidrunners are very good. (Carl Hammer, a very good Zion canyoneer, uses them for speed descents). — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > Thanx again Joe. I have REI gore-tex sox, which, > when I bought them, fit > better than the sealskins. I did have my eye on a > pair of shoes made by > Salomon, similar to trail runners, but a little > heavier(named “Raid”). They > look like the way to go. We did stop at Escalante > Outfitters a couple years > ago, and they do have the best pizza in s. > Utah(maybe n. Arizona too!). I > really appreciate your input. st
—–Original Message—– > From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 3:58 PM > To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
Shoes aren’t as important as “sealskins” for your > trip. Everybody recommends hiking boots, and their > reasons are good (ankle support, etc.), but I always > wear trail running shoes because they feel lighter > when wet and they dry out much quicker.
Sealskins are a kind of waterproof sock. They > aren’t > really waterproof, but they stop the FLOW of ice > cold > water through your feet. It is far more comfortable > (and safer!!!) when your feet don’t feel like blocks > of ice. I get ’em at REI, but I imagine that they > are > everywhere. Believe me, these things are worth > their > weight in gold on a cold water descent.
I’ve never used a wetsuit in Death Hollow, but it > should help you out on a November descent.
Good job for doing that canyon during quite time. > Please stop in and see my friends Barry and Celeste > at > the Escalante Outfitters. Barry makes the best > pizza > in southern Utah and Celeste pours a great Cutthroat > pale ale. They also keep their ears open for > conditions in the canyons.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
Thanx Joe. I have been informed about some noxious
weed in the vicinity,
could it be poison ivy? I will stay alert. Just
bought a wetsuit(4/3). Shoes
next. Any thoughts on canyoneering shoes? I have
hiking and mountaineering
boots, rock climbing shoes, bowling shoes, > softball
cleats, but I’m not sure
what would be appropriate for this type of trip. > Did
you say something about
poison ivy? thanx again. st
—–Original Message—–
From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 12:55 PM
To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in
Escalante?
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch > out
for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you have > a
dry bag at night is going to be critical, given > the
11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered > this
already, but be prepared for cold water and no sun
for
most of the day. You are going at a great time of
year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t
underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow > in
the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly
Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than the
main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for > poison
ivy? The very best canyon in that part of > Escalante
is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by the
mail
trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the nicest
slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death > Hollow
on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way,
mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, heads
Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd > class
in
difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste
your
time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going in
from the top or if you are going in from below.
There
is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from the
south rim just below Death Hollow if you are going
up
from the bottom.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
> A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in
> Escalante the first of
> November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff,
but
> it does sound
> interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I
think).
—–Original Message—–
> From: rcornia@visto.comrcornia@visto.com]
> Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM
> To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner
> technical canyons
> in
> Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good?
> Choprock? What
> canyons do you recommend for people with some
> canyoneering and
> climbing experience who want to err on the safe
> side? (ie- no 300
> foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of
> potholes, or setting
> anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am
looking
> for some
> relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering > Association
> http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group?
> Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email
> to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you
> must visit the web site to view messages.
Mail – Free email you can access from
anywhere!
http://mail.yahoo.com/
> Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association
http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group?
Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email
to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you
must visit the web site to view messages.
> > > Mail – Free email you can access from > anywhere! > http://mail.yahoo.com/
=== message truncated ===
Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Todd, Steve
Suspicions confirmed! thanx again Joe. Time to go home.
—–Original Message—– From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 4:31 PM To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
The REI sox are good, and the Raidrunners are very good. (Carl Hammer, a very good Zion canyoneer, uses them for speed descents). — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > Thanx again Joe. I have REI gore-tex sox, which, > when I bought them, fit > better than the sealskins. I did have my eye on a > pair of shoes made by > Salomon, similar to trail runners, but a little > heavier(named “Raid”). They > look like the way to go. We did stop at Escalante > Outfitters a couple years > ago, and they do have the best pizza in s. > Utah(maybe n. Arizona too!). I > really appreciate your input. st
—–Original Message—– > From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 3:58 PM > To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
Shoes aren’t as important as “sealskins” for your > trip. Everybody recommends hiking boots, and their > reasons are good (ankle support, etc.), but I always > wear trail running shoes because they feel lighter > when wet and they dry out much quicker.
Sealskins are a kind of waterproof sock. They > aren’t > really waterproof, but they stop the FLOW of ice > cold > water through your feet. It is far more comfortable > (and safer!!!) when your feet don’t feel like blocks > of ice. I get ’em at REI, but I imagine that they > are > everywhere. Believe me, these things are worth > their > weight in gold on a cold water descent.
I’ve never used a wetsuit in Death Hollow, but it > should help you out on a November descent.
Good job for doing that canyon during quite time. > Please stop in and see my friends Barry and Celeste > at > the Escalante Outfitters. Barry makes the best > pizza > in southern Utah and Celeste pours a great Cutthroat > pale ale. They also keep their ears open for > conditions in the canyons.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
Thanx Joe. I have been informed about some noxious
weed in the vicinity,
could it be poison ivy? I will stay alert. Just
bought a wetsuit(4/3). Shoes
next. Any thoughts on canyoneering shoes? I have
hiking and mountaineering
boots, rock climbing shoes, bowling shoes, > softball
cleats, but I’m not sure
what would be appropriate for this type of trip. > Did
you say something about
poison ivy? thanx again. st
—–Original Message—–
From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 12:55 PM
To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in
Escalante?
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch > out
for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you have > a
dry bag at night is going to be critical, given > the
11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered > this
already, but be prepared for cold water and no sun
for
most of the day. You are going at a great time of
year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t
underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow > in
the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly
Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than the
main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for > poison
ivy? The very best canyon in that part of > Escalante
is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by the
mail
trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the nicest
slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death > Hollow
on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way,
mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, heads
Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd > class
in
difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste
your
time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going in
from the top or if you are going in from below.
There
is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from the
south rim just below Death Hollow if you are going
up
from the bottom.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
> A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in
> Escalante the first of
> November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff,
but
> it does sound
> interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I
think).
—–Original Message—–
> From: rcornia@visto.comrcornia@visto.com]
> Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM
> To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner
> technical canyons
> in
> Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good?
> Choprock? What
> canyons do you recommend for people with some
> canyoneering and
> climbing experience who want to err on the safe
> side? (ie- no 300
> foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of
> potholes, or setting
> anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am
looking
> for some
> relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering > Association
> http://www.canyoneering.net
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Todd, Steve
Thanx again Joe. I have REI gore-tex sox, which, when I bought them, fit better than the sealskins. I did have my eye on a pair of shoes made by Salomon, similar to trail runners, but a little heavier(named “Raid”). They look like the way to go. We did stop at Escalante Outfitters a couple years ago, and they do have the best pizza in s. Utah(maybe n. Arizona too!). I really appreciate your input. st
—–Original Message—– From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 3:58 PM To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
Shoes aren’t as important as “sealskins” for your trip. Everybody recommends hiking boots, and their reasons are good (ankle support, etc.), but I always wear trail running shoes because they feel lighter when wet and they dry out much quicker.
Sealskins are a kind of waterproof sock. They aren’t really waterproof, but they stop the FLOW of ice cold water through your feet. It is far more comfortable (and safer!!!) when your feet don’t feel like blocks of ice. I get ’em at REI, but I imagine that they are everywhere. Believe me, these things are worth their weight in gold on a cold water descent.
I’ve never used a wetsuit in Death Hollow, but it should help you out on a November descent.
Good job for doing that canyon during quite time. Please stop in and see my friends Barry and Celeste at the Escalante Outfitters. Barry makes the best pizza in southern Utah and Celeste pours a great Cutthroat pale ale. They also keep their ears open for conditions in the canyons.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > Thanx Joe. I have been informed about some noxious > weed in the vicinity, > could it be poison ivy? I will stay alert. Just > bought a wetsuit(4/3). Shoes > next. Any thoughts on canyoneering shoes? I have > hiking and mountaineering > boots, rock climbing shoes, bowling shoes, softball > cleats, but I’m not sure > what would be appropriate for this type of trip. Did > you say something about > poison ivy? thanx again. st
—–Original Message—– > From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 12:55 PM > To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch out > for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you have a > dry bag at night is going to be critical, given the > 11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered this > already, but be prepared for cold water and no sun > for > most of the day. You are going at a great time of > year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t > underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow in > the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly > Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than the > main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for poison > ivy? The very best canyon in that part of Escalante > is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by the > mail > trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the nicest > slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death Hollow > on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way, > mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, heads > Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd class > in > difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste > your > time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going in > from the top or if you are going in from below. > There > is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from the > south rim just below Death Hollow if you are going > up > from the bottom. > — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in
Escalante the first of
November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff, > but
it does sound
interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I > think).
—–Original Message—–
From: rcornia@visto.com [mailto:rcornia@visto.com]
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM
To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner
technical canyons
in
Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good?
Choprock? What
canyons do you recommend for people with some
canyoneering and
climbing experience who want to err on the safe
side? (ie- no 300
foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of
potholes, or setting
anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am > looking
for some
relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association
http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group?
Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email
to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you
must visit the web site to view messages.
> > > Mail – Free email you can access from > anywhere! > http://mail.yahoo.com/
> Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association > http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? > Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
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Joe Wrona
Shoes aren’t as important as “sealskins” for your trip. Everybody recommends hiking boots, and their reasons are good (ankle support, etc.), but I always wear trail running shoes because they feel lighter when wet and they dry out much quicker.
Sealskins are a kind of waterproof sock. They aren’t really waterproof, but they stop the FLOW of ice cold water through your feet. It is far more comfortable (and safer!!!) when your feet don’t feel like blocks of ice. I get ’em at REI, but I imagine that they are everywhere. Believe me, these things are worth their weight in gold on a cold water descent.
I’ve never used a wetsuit in Death Hollow, but it should help you out on a November descent.
Good job for doing that canyon during quite time. Please stop in and see my friends Barry and Celeste at the Escalante Outfitters. Barry makes the best pizza in southern Utah and Celeste pours a great Cutthroat pale ale. They also keep their ears open for conditions in the canyons.
— “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > Thanx Joe. I have been informed about some noxious > weed in the vicinity, > could it be poison ivy? I will stay alert. Just > bought a wetsuit(4/3). Shoes > next. Any thoughts on canyoneering shoes? I have > hiking and mountaineering > boots, rock climbing shoes, bowling shoes, softball > cleats, but I’m not sure > what would be appropriate for this type of trip. Did > you say something about > poison ivy? thanx again. st
—–Original Message—– > From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 12:55 PM > To: canyons@egroups.com Escalante?
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch out > for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you have a > dry bag at night is going to be critical, given the > 11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered this > already, but be prepared for cold water and no sun > for > most of the day. You are going at a great time of > year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t > underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow in > the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly > Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than the > main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for poison > ivy? The very best canyon in that part of Escalante > is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by the > mail > trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the nicest > slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death Hollow > on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way, > mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, heads > Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd class > in > difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste > your > time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going in > from the top or if you are going in from below. > There > is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from the > south rim just below Death Hollow if you are going > up > from the bottom. > — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote:
A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in
Escalante the first of
November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff, > but
it does sound
interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I > think).
—–Original Message—–
From: rcornia@visto.com [mailto:rcornia@visto.com]
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM
To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner
technical canyons
in
Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good?
Choprock? What
canyons do you recommend for people with some
canyoneering and
climbing experience who want to err on the safe
side? (ie- no 300
foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of
potholes, or setting
anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am > looking
for some
relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association
http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group?
Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email
to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you
must visit the web site to view messages.
> > > Mail – Free email you can access from > anywhere! > http://mail.yahoo.com/
> Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association > http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? > Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
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Todd, Steve
We wouldn’t think of installing bolts. Neither of us has the experience to do so, and philosophically, we wouldn’t be inclined to do such a thing. Again, thanx for the beta. st
—–Original Message—– From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 1:31 PM To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: Re: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
The Wingate slots in the Escalante Region are all relatively easy and very escape friendly. No trap pools, no aiding. Neon is outstanding from the top; if you park at the Moody Canyon turnout and ascend the weakness to the north, you can then cross country over to the canyon, drop in and descend. The anchors are very straightforward and so are the drops. If it fairly dry, Neon goes very fast; if it is wet, it is a “rap ‘n swim” trip.
Ringtail is also a nice descent for new canyoneers. If you are inclined to set up a base camp and take day trips into slots, use the Fence Canyon access and base in lower Choprock. Choprock is a nice walk one day, and you can do the last bit of Neon on another day with maybe some Ringtail mixed in. Upper Baker is worth a visit some time.
For what it is worth, there are many regular users of the Escalanate canyons who consider the region to be worth protecting from bolts. — rcornia@visto.com wrote: > I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner > technical canyons > in > Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good? > Choprock? What > canyons do you recommend for people with some > canyoneering and > climbing experience who want to err on the safe > side? (ie- no 300 > foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of > potholes, or setting > anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am looking > for some > relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
>
Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association http://www.canyoneering.net
Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
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Todd, Steve
Thanx Joe. I have been informed about some noxious weed in the vicinity, could it be poison ivy? I will stay alert. Just bought a wetsuit(4/3). Shoes next. Any thoughts on canyoneering shoes? I have hiking and mountaineering boots, rock climbing shoes, bowling shoes, softball cleats, but I’m not sure what would be appropriate for this type of trip. Did you say something about poison ivy? thanx again. st
—–Original Message—– From: Joe Wrona [mailto:iko_iko_all_day@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 12:55 PM To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: RE: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch out for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you have a dry bag at night is going to be critical, given the 11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered this already, but be prepared for cold water and no sun for most of the day. You are going at a great time of year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow in the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than the main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for poison ivy? The very best canyon in that part of Escalante is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by the mail trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the nicest slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death Hollow on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way, mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, heads Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd class in difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste your time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going in from the top or if you are going in from below. There is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from the south rim just below Death Hollow if you are going up from the bottom. — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in > Escalante the first of > November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff, but > it does sound > interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I think).
—–Original Message—– > From: rcornia@visto.com [mailto:rcornia@visto.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM > To: canyons@egroups.com technical canyons > in > Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good? > Choprock? What > canyons do you recommend for people with some > canyoneering and > climbing experience who want to err on the safe > side? (ie- no 300 > foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of > potholes, or setting > anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am looking > for some > relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association > http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? > Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you > must visit the web site to view messages.
Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association http://www.canyoneering.net
Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
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Joe Wrona
The Wingate slots in the Escalante Region are all relatively easy and very escape friendly. No trap pools, no aiding. Neon is outstanding from the top; if you park at the Moody Canyon turnout and ascend the weakness to the north, you can then cross country over to the canyon, drop in and descend. The anchors are very straightforward and so are the drops. If it fairly dry, Neon goes very fast; if it is wet, it is a “rap ‘n swim” trip.
Ringtail is also a nice descent for new canyoneers. If you are inclined to set up a base camp and take day trips into slots, use the Fence Canyon access and base in lower Choprock. Choprock is a nice walk one day, and you can do the last bit of Neon on another day with maybe some Ringtail mixed in. Upper Baker is worth a visit some time.
For what it is worth, there are many regular users of the Escalanate canyons who consider the region to be worth protecting from bolts. — rcornia@visto.com wrote: > I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner > technical canyons > in > Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good? > Choprock? What > canyons do you recommend for people with some > canyoneering and > climbing experience who want to err on the safe > side? (ie- no 300 > foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of > potholes, or setting > anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am looking > for some > relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
>
Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Joe Wrona
Death Hollow is a very nice watery hike. Watch out for poison ivy. Protecting your gear so you have a dry bag at night is going to be critical, given the 11/1 outing date. I’m sure you have considered this already, but be prepared for cold water and no sun for most of the day. You are going at a great time of year for solace and desert beauty, but don’t underestimate the icebox quality of Death Hollow in the late fall. Anyway, enough of that.
The forks in the midsection, particularly Mamie/Moonshadow, are as good (or better) than the main canyon. Did I mention to watch out for poison ivy? The very best canyon in that part of Escalante is OB/Desert Rose, and that can be reached by the mail trail from lower Death Hollow. One of the nicest slickrock hikes that I have done leaves Death Hollow on the mail trail, ascends Desert Rose part way, mounts the ridge between OB and Moonshadow, heads Moonshadow, then drops in. Its maybe 2nd-3rd class in difficulty. Sand Canyon is CPOS, so don’t waste your time in there. Did I warn you about poison ivy?
I couldn’t tell from your note if you are going in from the top or if you are going in from below. There is a fun way to enter the Escalante gorge from the south rim just below Death Hollow if you are going up from the bottom. — “Todd, Steve” stodd@puc.sf.ca.us> wrote: > A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in > Escalante the first of > November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff, but > it does sound > interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I think).
—–Original Message—– > From: rcornia@visto.com [mailto:rcornia@visto.com] > Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM > To: canyons@egroups.com technical canyons > in > Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good? > Choprock? What > canyons do you recommend for people with some > canyoneering and > climbing experience who want to err on the safe > side? (ie- no 300 > foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of > potholes, or setting > anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am looking > for some > relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association > http://www.canyoneering.net
> Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? > Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day’s messages.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you > must visit the web site to view messages.
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Todd, Steve
A friend and I are headed to Death Hollow in Escalante the first of November. Don’t know if this is beginner stuff, but it does sound interesting(Steve Allen’s Canyoneering 3, I think).
—–Original Message—– From: rcornia@visto.com [mailto:rcornia@visto.com] Sent: Friday, September 15, 2000 11:20 AM To: canyons@egroups.com Subject: [canyons] Beginning Canyons in Escalante?
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner technical canyons in Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good? Choprock? What canyons do you recommend for people with some canyoneering and climbing experience who want to err on the safe side? (ie- no 300 foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of potholes, or setting anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am looking for some relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.
Sponsored by the American Canyoneering Association http://www.canyoneering.net
Getting too much email from the Canyons Group? Don’t unsubscribe; change your email options.
WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you must visit the web site to view messages.
rcornia@visto.com
I was curious what everyone’s favorite beginner technical canyons in Escalante are? Is Neon from the top fairly good? Choprock? What canyons do you recommend for people with some canyoneering and climbing experience who want to err on the safe side? (ie- no 300 foot rappels off a rock bollard, hooking out of potholes, or setting anchors…)
I’m going to be down there in October as am looking for some relatively easy day trips for my wife and I.
Thanks.