— In canyons@y…, “apolobamba2001”
Is this edge that sharp? I didn’t think so, but…
> With > any rope, this can lead abrasion of the rope because all ropes > elongate under load. Obviously, Dynamic ropes elongate and bounce > more than static.
“Bounce” is caused by the user and should be minimized, dynamic or static rope! With this rappel, should be NO bounce! Gentle and smooth!
> If there are a lot of people in your group, the > use of a rope protector or a backpack under the rope can help > protect the rope a lot. I noticed the group before our group, > rappelling over the ledge without any protection.
I’ve never used protection over that “ledge” as usually, the slings/rap ring are long enough that the rope doesn’t “see” an edge. Perhaps extending the anchor to avoid a “ledge” is better than stuffing some item under your rope?
> The last person is always at more risk. The knot that ties the 2 > ropes together should be positioned over the ridge for the last > person. If you do not, it can hang up at the ledge. This is very > common at this rappel. Also, the last person will have to remove the > rope protection in order to pull the ropes. The last person should > rappel evenly and avoid pendulums to alleviate abrasion at the ledge.
Does hang up, but, probably due as much to a twist in the rope which gets trapped in the rope grooves. I freed a parties rope with just a simply cross over twist from the rap rings into the rope groove. They couldn’t budge it.
Pick a less severe rope groove for the last man down, set the rope in, make sure no twist from anchor, keep track of strands (clip biner on sling above device?), bottom belay from partner, let ‘er rip. Pull slow and steady and your headin’ for the road…
> 1 mm is not really a big enough difference to make a big deal.
Nice to go off 60m rope. No knot to feed over edge. No knot debate…!
> I have seen a lot of Europeans connect 2 ropes by an overhand knot. > I find this unacceptable. I usually tie the ropes together by a > figure 8 and half-fisherman.
Heavy sigh…har har…
Make my rap knot a simple overhand, even connecting a 7mm static to a 10.5 dynamic. KISS!
Brian in SLC
kv5476
I have seen a lot of Europeans connect 2 ropes by an overhand knot.
I find this unacceptable. I usually tie the ropes together by a
figure 8 and half-fisherman. >
Allright, a quick overview of popular knots to join 2 ropes with pro’s and con’s:
-Fisherman or double fisherman: very difficult to undo afterwards, the worst knot for rope retrieval – try sliding one over an edge in the rock, it just stops. you need a lot of rope to make one. Dangerous if not correctly made because impossible to control visually: I can make a fisherman that looks 100 % allright but comes loose under tension (I know because I just bet 5 beers on it and won !). – threaded 8: not as bad retrieval habits of a fisherman’s but close. Moderately easy to undo, especially if you poke a carabiner or a twig through the knot. Can be checked visually. – “overhand” 8: behaves good while retrieving ropes – it turns away from the rock at each friction point, equally easy/difficult to undo as threaded 8. Can be checked visually. – overhand “European death” knot: easy to make, perfect for retrieval, dead easy to undo, can be checked visually. Only caution: leave an ample tail. Drawback: looks scary.
Important: every knot should be tightened on ALL FOUR ends, especially the overhand knot – hence the big tail in case you forget
Nono: making a knot and adding another one “just to make sure”. That eats up more rope, is just another knot or loop that can get stuck during retrieval…. either a knot is good as is, or it isn’t !
Koen