I am gearing up for a Zion trip in the spring, and would appreciate some input on what would be a good choice for rope. What is everybody using? thanks randy
Yahoo Canyons Group
I am gearing up for a Zion trip in the spring, and would appreciate some input on what would be a good choice for rope. What is everybody using? thanks randy
Kris Nosack
On Mon, 4 Oct 2004, Hubert Shen wrote:
ie. it’s their normal KM III rope (but with tighter sheath),…
Very interesting. I’ve used my KM III for canyoneering for 3 years and have been very happy with this rope. I don’t get out to canyoneer that much, but the rope seems to be holding up well. The rope has very good feel and knots (and unknots) well. Some sheath damage from edge rubs, but the core is fine. A tighter sheath would make this rope even better, me thinks.
– Kris Nosack
Hubert Shen
Just don’t tell him you’re going to rappel on it, or he’ll start in with his disclaimer about how you can’t safely rappel on 8mm rope…tell him you want it for anchors etc.
—–Original Message—– From: Tom Jones [mailto:tom@jrat.com] Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 12:17 PM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: Re: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
Got a phone number for them?
tom
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Hubert Shen” wrote: > Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm
with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm, though not as stiff as the PMI Max wear 5/16″. Green with orange thread, $0.63 per foot. THey also carry Stirling kevlar sheath/nylon core 8mm rope at $0.99 per foot, although given the purported poor longevity of kevlar fibers, I would be leery of buying it. > > Hubert >
When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
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Hubert Shen
HAWILL’S LTD (508)366-7496 FAX (508)366-0211 hawills@hawills.com
—–Original Message—– From: Tom Jones [mailto:tom@jrat.com] Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 12:17 PM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: Re: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
Got a phone number for them?
tom
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Hubert Shen” wrote: > Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm
with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm, though not as stiff as the PMI Max wear 5/16″. Green with orange thread, $0.63 per foot. THey also carry Stirling kevlar sheath/nylon core 8mm rope at $0.99 per foot, although given the purported poor longevity of kevlar fibers, I would be leery of buying it. > > Hubert >
Tom Jones
Got a phone number for them?
tom
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Hubert Shen” wrote: > Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm, though not as stiff as the PMI Max wear 5/16″. Green with orange thread, $0.63 per foot. THey also carry Stirling kevlar sheath/nylon core 8mm rope at $0.99 per foot, although given the purported poor longevity of kevlar fibers, I would be leery of buying it.
Hubert >
Hubert Shen
FWIW I was able (after a fair amount of work) to cut a small cross-section off the end with an EMT shears…which to me suggests nylon, rather than spectra…But don’t take my word for it, give Hawills a call
—–Original Message—– From: Hubert Shen [mailto:hhs@numeric.com] Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 6:26 AM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
ie. it’s their normal KM III rope (but with tighter sheath), can be cut and melted normally, unlike the aramid core ropes…
—–Original Message—– From: Hubert Shen Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 6:16 AM To: ‘canyons@yahoogroups.com’ Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
I was told this rope is exactly the same as regular New England 8mm (polyester sheath, nylon core) except that the tension of the thread going into the sheath was set to be much higher than normal, making for a tighter sheath…no aramid…
—–Original Message—– From: neil wilkinson [mailto:mtngoat59102@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 10:28 PM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
Do not buy a rope like this if the core is made of Aramid fibers, as I’m guessing the below described rope may be …
Hubert Shen hhs@numeric.com> wrote:Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm
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When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
Subject: BIZ~ New Abbreviation List – working?
Bombastic Bolt Debates are allowed to only a limited extent. Folks should go to the Canyoneer Group for a truly un-moderated forum. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyoneer
To change your delivery options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
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When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
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Hubert Shen
ie. it’s their normal KM III rope (but with tighter sheath), can be cut and melted normally, unlike the aramid core ropes…
—–Original Message—– From: Hubert Shen Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 6:16 AM To: ‘canyons@yahoogroups.com’ Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
I was told this rope is exactly the same as regular New England 8mm (polyester sheath, nylon core) except that the tension of the thread going into the sheath was set to be much higher than normal, making for a tighter sheath…no aramid…
—–Original Message—– From: neil wilkinson [mailto:mtngoat59102@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 10:28 PM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
Do not buy a rope like this if the core is made of Aramid fibers, as I’m guessing the below described rope may be …
Hubert Shen hhs@numeric.com> wrote:Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm
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When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
Subject: BIZ~ New Abbreviation List – working?
Bombastic Bolt Debates are allowed to only a limited extent. Folks should go to the Canyoneer Group for a truly un-moderated forum. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyoneer
To change your delivery options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
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Hubert Shen
I was told this rope is exactly the same as regular New England 8mm (polyester sheath, nylon core) except that the tension of the thread going into the sheath was set to be much higher than normal, making for a tighter sheath…no aramid…
—–Original Message—– From: neil wilkinson [mailto:mtngoat59102@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 10:28 PM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
Do not buy a rope like this if the core is made of Aramid fibers, as I’m guessing the below described rope may be …
Hubert Shen hhs@numeric.com> wrote:Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm
vote.yahoo.com – Register online to vote today!
When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
Subject: BIZ~ New Abbreviation List – working?
Bombastic Bolt Debates are allowed to only a limited extent. Folks should go to the Canyoneer Group for a truly un-moderated forum. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyoneer
To change your delivery options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
This will require logging into Yahoo. Click on the "Edit My Membership" link, and change your delivery option. Press "Save Changes".
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neil wilkinson
Do not buy a rope like this if the core is made of Aramid fibers, as I’m guessing the below described rope may be …
Hubert Shen hhs@numeric.com> wrote:Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm
vote.yahoo.com – Register online to vote today!
Hubert Shen
Hawills Ltd in Westborough Mass has a spool of New England 8mm with an extra tight sheath. Specially made up for fire dept personal escape line in broken glass environments, supposedly. It is definitely more cable-like than the standard New England 8mm, though not as stiff as the PMI Max wear 5/16″. Green with orange thread, $0.63 per foot. THey also carry Stirling kevlar sheath/nylon core 8mm rope at $0.99 per foot, although given the purported poor longevity of kevlar fibers, I would be leery of buying it.
Hubert
—–Original Message—– From: Hank Moon [mailto:hmoon@petzl.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2004 12:13 PM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
BTW, the PMI is great rope. The only reason it’s my number 3 and not 2 is it’s heavier than the others…
Hercules 8 mm New England 8 mm PMI 5/16″ Max-Wear
hank
Shane Burrows
>>I am gearing up for a Zion trip in the spring, and would appreciate some input on what would be a good choice for rope. What is everybody using?
Hank Moon
Agree in principle w/Neil on beginner points…if that beginner has no rope experience at all. Absolute beginners should use larger diameters until they “know the ropes”
hank
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neil wilkinson
Rope is something that kind of depends on your own experience and demands. I wouldn’t advise most people to buy an 8mm rope as their first rope. It’s fast and unforgiving, it’s also light and soaks up little water. What is your experience level and how do you see yourself using the rope? I frequently recommend the Blue Water 9.2mm Canyon as a great rope if you are unsure of what you want. It’s a good balance of toughness, weight and forgiveness.
All the ropes on Hank’s list are great ropes, I happen to really like the Canyon Pro / PMI Maxwear, etc. but would not send a beginner down to the store to pick up a spool.
Neil
Hank Moon hmoon@petzl.com> wrote:
Currently using (in order of preference):
Hercules 8 mm New England 8 mm PMI 5/16″ Max-Wear
hank
Read only the mail you want – Mail SpamGuard.
restrac2000
Realized that the first time I took it down Pine Creek, touched the water after the second person went down. Fun few minutes up top rigging the rappel waiting for the “sploosh” of rope down. Never came. Stretched exactly one foot if I remember right for a doubled 100ft rappel.
Damn Snake Couloir, 17 inches new snow, banter, banter….now I’m stuck doing Neon and Choprock. Poor me, poor me.
“Youth”
> That plus Canyon Pro has practically zero stretch…sometimes a little > stretch helps get you down. >
Hank Moon
That plus Canyon Pro has practically zero stretch…sometimes a little stretch helps get you down.
>My only reccomendation is buy it longer than you >desire, if you need a 60m, buy one at 65m. The wet than dry nature >of canyoneering tends to shrink ropes rather drastically.
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restrac2000
I still use my trusty Canyon Pro, mainly on the fact I can’t afford another rope right now. Would prefer to have the Canyon.
Benefits/Cons Pro seems to eat through gear much faster, especially when it gets just a minute amount of wet sand on it. Yet, compared to my friends Canyon it seems to take abrasion better.
Buy what you believe is the best and live with its benefits and limitations. My only reccomendation is buy it longer than you desire, if you need a 60m, buy one at 65m. The wet than dry nature of canyoneering tends to shrink ropes rather drastically.
> I am gearing up for a Zion trip in the spring, and would appreciate > some input on what would be a good choice for rope. What is > everybody using? > thanks > randy
Hank Moon
They work well in canyons
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Paul Sailer
why do you like these ropes —– Original Message —– From: Hank Moon To: Yahoo Canyons Group Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2004 9:11 AM Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Rope recommendations
Currently using (in order of preference):
Hercules 8 mm New England 8 mm PMI 5/16″ Max-Wear
hank
——————— The information in this message and/or attachments is intended solely for the attention and use of the named addressee and may be confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, you have received this e-mail in error and any use of it is prohibited. In such a case please notify the sender and kindly delete this message from your computer and network.
Thank you, Petzl America
When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
Subject: BIZ~ New Abbreviation List – working?
Bombastic Bolt Debates are allowed to only a limited extent. Folks should go to the Canyoneer Group for a truly un-moderated forum. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyoneer
To change your delivery options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
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Hank Moon
BTW, the PMI is great rope. The only reason it’s my number 3 and not 2 is it’s heavier than the others…
Hercules 8 mm New England 8 mm PMI 5/16″ Max-Wear
hank
——————— The information in this message and/or attachments is intended solely for the attention and use of the named addressee and may be confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, you have received this e-mail in error and any use of it is prohibited. In such a case please notify the sender and kindly delete this message from your computer and network.
Thank you, Petzl America
When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
Subject: BIZ~ New Abbreviation List – working?
Bombastic Bolt Debates are allowed to only a limited extent. Folks should go to the Canyoneer Group for a truly un-moderated forum. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyoneer
To change your delivery options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
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Hank Moon
Currently using (in order of preference):
Hercules 8 mm New England 8 mm PMI 5/16″ Max-Wear
hank
——————— The information in this message and/or attachments is intended solely for the attention and use of the named addressee and may be confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, you have received this e-mail in error and any use of it is prohibited. In such a case please notify the sender and kindly delete this message from your computer and network.
Thank you, Petzl America