One thing I like to do is tie the rappel rope into the anchor with a clove hitch and after each rappeller gets down lower out a foot or two of rope through the hitch. By doing this, the section of rope running over the rough edge(s) will differ for each rappeller. This can help prevent serious abrasions, especially with large groups.
This “technique” is particularly nice if you’re rappelling with a group of folks who are not very experienced. For example, you’re not making first-time rappellers worry about tending the edge protection on the way down, and the second rope normally used for edge protection (the 6mm in this case) is free to used for belay, rescue, etc.
Rich’s trick is superior in terms of the absolute best rope protection, but the above method works pretty well in a pinch.
Moab Matt
— In canyons@y…, “rcwildone”
The advantage of doing it this way is that no one in the group has > to pass the protection, connect it or reconnect it. The only catch is > that people need to pay attention and control where the rope > comes to rest on the edge as they go over.
Rich
s_mestdagh
At the risk of starting another “my device is better” thread, I’d like to point out the simple and light is good. I use a Trango Pyramid for canyoneering and climbing. Lighter than a ‘8’ or Magic and simple. You can rap on thin or fat ropes (just flip it over). No rope twist while rapping and can belay 2 at once. Autolock? Yep. Just wrap the rope below the device (any device) around your thigh 4 times. The Trango Pyramid is similar to the Black Diamond device (forget the name) except you can’t flip the BD device around to adjust for lower friction (smaller rope diameter) raps.
steve
rcwildone
> I read somewhere that a GiGi can be used as an ascender. I assume that the GiGi’s autolocking feature is what facilitates this. In a pinch, how easy is it to use one as an ascender (vs, say, a petzl huit/square 8)? >
Works pretty much the same way; attached to your harness with a footloop rigged above.
> Second, I’m considering ditching my huit for a trango magic (yeah, it’s hard, like giving up smoking). So…
Does the design of the magic minimize rope twisting on double strand rappels (using it in figure 8 mode, that is)? >
In figure 8 mode, standard or canyon, the twisting will be the same as with a regular 8, but this can virtually be eliminated with appropriate rope techniques. In carabiner brake mode there is virtually no twisting.
> How easy is it to lock off the magic in mid rappel, vs the huit? >
Actually much easier to lock off a Magic than a regular 8.
> How smooth is it on rappel? >
No different than a regular 8 on thin ropes or single strand. Less smooth on thick ropes double strand.
> If I need to use it in emergency ascend mode, is it better to use the 8 portion of it as the ascender, or the gigi portion (see first question)? >
The advantage of rigging it with the 8 portion is that you don’t have to stop and rerig to come back down; just shift into reverse.
> Any other observations pro or con between it and a huit? >
The Trango Magic is my favorite device for canyoneering — unless I know I am going out with thick ropes, in which case I will use my Petzl Huit.
Rich
mike_dallin
— In canyons@y…, “rcwildone” wrote: > In place of the clove hitch, you can also use a munter and a > mule, even with two strands of rope. If you happen to carry a GiGi > or a Trango Magic, they work even slicker.
Rich and Charly (and anyone else, for that matter), a few questions on the GiGi and Magic…
I read somewhere that a GiGi can be used as an ascender. I assume that the GiGi’s autolocking feature is what facilitates this. In a pinch, how easy is it to use one as an ascender (vs, say, a petzl huit/square 8)?
Second, I’m considering ditching my huit for a trango magic (yeah, it’s hard, like giving up smoking). So…
Does the design of the magic minimize rope twisting on double strand rappels (using it in figure 8 mode, that is)?
How easy is it to lock off the magic in mid rappel, vs the huit?
How smooth is it on rappel?
If I need to use it in emergency ascend mode, is it better to use the 8 portion of it as the ascender, or the gigi portion (see first question)?
Any other observations pro or con between it and a huit?
Thanks,
Mike dallin@on-line.com
rcwildone
A GiGi is a device, made by Kong, that has a hole in each end and two slots running in between. It is used a lot by climbing guides because it allows belaying two climbers at the same time. Pull up one strand and let go; it locks automatically. Pull up the other strand and let go; etc.
It works well in the system Matt described. Run the rope through the anchor to the mid point so people can rappel on two strands. Clip a GiGi to the anchor, pull up about eight feet of slack and rig the rope to the GiGi. Each time someone goes down, release another foot or two of rope so the abrasion point is constantly changing.
The Trango Magic is way cool. It will function as a GiGi, figure eight, carabiner brake and more.
Rich
Scott Holley
Rich, what is a GiGi? –scott
—– Original Message —– From: “rcwildone” rcwild@wildernessmail.net> To: Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 10:00 AM Subject: [from Canyons Group] Re: Ropes & Edges WAS: More rope questions, by the foot?
> Matt,
In place of the clove hitch, you can also use a munter and a > mule, even with two strands of rope. If you happen to carry a GiGi > or a Trango Magic, they work even slicker.
Rich
PS Someday over a beer ask me what gigi means in Apache.
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rcwildone
Matt,
In place of the clove hitch, you can also use a munter and a mule, even with two strands of rope. If you happen to carry a GiGi or a Trango Magic, they work even slicker.
Rich
PS Someday over a beer ask me what gigi means in Apache.
Dean Kurtz
> PS Someday over a beer ask me what gigi means in Apache.< I know the answer!