— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Tom Jones”
Ok,
I know why you ware a helmet and gloves. A draining pack makes sense. Tubular device for the floating disconnects. Figure 8’s suck.
What I am not sure of is why would a pack dangler be better that wearing it? Is it so you can quickly disconnect it under a waterfall?
And what advantages does a single line rappel have besides the a lowered rappel option? Doesn’t the last one down have to double anyways?
James Wadsworth
John Styrnol
“Using a biner block, it’s easy to set the length of a single line rap so you can just rap off the end into a pool.”
This definitly helps. Also fatter ropes and ATCs do not mix well with water.
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “tnunemac” wrote:
And what advantages does a single line rappel have besides the a
lowered rappel option? Doesn’t the last one down have to double
anyways?
Using a biner block, it’s easy to set the length of a single line rap > so you can just rap off the end into a pool. That’s nice, sometimes, > not having to disconnect. And I hear that you don’t want extra rope > in those hydraulic dealies, if you’re in a canyon where the water > moves – I wouldn’t know this firsthand.
Last one down doesn’t have to double up. With a biner block setup, > one strand is blocked (which makes it good for rapping on), while the > other is used to retrieve the rope. You can also clip things so that > you can rap either strand, then unclip for the last one down – that’s > what we usually end up doing. Trying to get in the habit of tying > contingencies, but haven’t succeeded yet.
> I’m talking a standard 8. Does a Pirahna have teeth?
No teeth on a Pirana, only… er… wings. Maybe that’s why they > dropped the “h”? I enjoyed using my first Pirana, before I put a big > shiny groove in it on the last rap in an Escalante canyon this spring. > Tragic. Here’s a nice picture of one, for reference:
http://www.telemark-pyrenees.com/Petzl-Pirana-D05.htm
… Sportsman’s Warehouse wetsuits …
Only wetsuit I’ve ever owned was a 2mm full I bought at Sportsman’s > Warehouse. Cost $45 at the time. I was a little cold in Echo in late > October in this wetsuit. This spring, I bought a 2mm shorty at SW to > layer with the full. It kept me perfectly warm in a couple Escalante > canyons, one of them a dawn to dusk canyon with lots of water. $35 > now for the shorty, $50 for the full?
The SWs on the Front Range have dressing rooms, though it’s possible > things are more primitive out in Utah. Tent shoppers, beware.
-Tyson
tnunemac
> And what advantages does a single line rappel have besides the a > lowered rappel option? Doesn’t the last one down have to double > anyways?
Using a biner block, it’s easy to set the length of a single line rap so you can just rap off the end into a pool. That’s nice, sometimes, not having to disconnect. And I hear that you don’t want extra rope in those hydraulic dealies, if you’re in a canyon where the water moves – I wouldn’t know this firsthand.
Last one down doesn’t have to double up. With a biner block setup, one strand is blocked (which makes it good for rapping on), while the other is used to retrieve the rope. You can also clip things so that you can rap either strand, then unclip for the last one down – that’s what we usually end up doing. Trying to get in the habit of tying contingencies, but haven’t succeeded yet.
> I’m talking a standard 8. Does a Pirahna have teeth?
No teeth on a Pirana, only… er… wings. Maybe that’s why they dropped the “h”? I enjoyed using my first Pirana, before I put a big shiny groove in it on the last rap in an Escalante canyon this spring. Tragic. Here’s a nice picture of one, for reference:
http://www.telemark-pyrenees.com/Petzl-Pirana-D05.htm
> … Sportsman’s Warehouse wetsuits …
Only wetsuit I’ve ever owned was a 2mm full I bought at Sportsman’s Warehouse. Cost $45 at the time. I was a little cold in Echo in late October in this wetsuit. This spring, I bought a 2mm shorty at SW to layer with the full. It kept me perfectly warm in a couple Escalante canyons, one of them a dawn to dusk canyon with lots of water. $35 now for the shorty, $50 for the full?
The SWs on the Front Range have dressing rooms, though it’s possible things are more primitive out in Utah. Tent shoppers, beware.
-Tyson
Tom Jones
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “James B Wadsworth” wrote:
What I am not sure of is why would a pack dangler be better that > wearing it? Is it so you can quickly disconnect it under a waterfall? >
If your pack has any weight to it, wearing it while rappelling can be a problem especially on long and steep rappels, where your stomach muscles are used to hold it up. If you dangle the pack on a sling or two from your belay loop (or strong back loop some people prefer), it is below you and you do not have to hold it upright.
“Many people” have lost control of their rappels because their pack tipped them over backward. In a waterfall, the force of the water can have a tendency to tip you over backward, made worse by having a heavy pack on.
> And what advantages does a single line rappel have besides the a > lowered rappel option? Doesn’t the last one down have to double > anyways?
A single rope is a simpler system. Twists in the rope, because you let that Phoenix gal rap with her figure 8 first, can immobilize a person using a slot-type device. Double ropes hanging in flowing water will often twist up due to water flow. Single ropes have fewer problems with twists.
As an added advantage, single ropes are easier to rig in your ATC- type device. There’s a death or two a year of people rapping with only one side properly rigged on an ATC, taking the rope with them (usually ice climbing, as I recall).
No, the last person does not have to rap double. Sometimes best to, sometimes not.
And yes, a single line is somewhat easier to set up with a contingency anchor.
YMMV, etc. Using a single line tears up ropes faster. Helps if everyone in the party is prepared for and comfortable with rapping the rope du jour single.
Tom
Hank Moon
I know why you ware a helmet and gloves.
***Ooooh. Brian? Any comment ’bout gloves?
Tubular device for the floating disconnects.
***What’s the specific advantage of a tubular device here?
Figure 8’s suck.
*** Eh? 8s are just fine. Most popular wet canyon device there is…
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Thank you, Petzl America
me you
somebody….wrote:
Or perhaps you wear your 40 > lb, non-draining pack on your back, wear no helmet or glove, and rap double on 11mm worn out climbing ropes with a figure 8 – but you’re “way experienced”.
God! That sounds like me! Except for the helmet part! ; )
~R
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