For anyone interested I ran Big Falls Canyon (aka Canyon of the Damned) with 2 friends in the Sierra foothills in September. Pictures at: http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#
We ran the canyon with 2 x 200 ft ropes in 3 mm farmer jobs with neotops and were very comfortable for most of the trip. The canyon took about 7 hours. Fun straight forward canyon with lots of unnecessary bolts. While it lacks the splendor of “Lower Jump” and the jumps it also lacks the slog out as the exit is pretty quick and easy. Lots of bang for your buck, easy shuttle, easy approach, fun rappels, good scenery, and easy exit.
Beta note: The “Penstock” which we took to mean giant pipe next to dirt road was repainted so we never found a section marked 250 but if you hike to the gate house at the end of the road you get a great view and easy approach down the forested slope to almost immediately the first rappel.
Cheers! Ken
Sati Shah
Canyon of the Dammed does have a lot of unnecessary bolts. Some are kinda funny like the “glamor shot” set and some are ridiculous like the 2 sets that you can use a huge tree instead of.
As I understand it, this canyon has been descended by climber types and “all bolts, all the time types” for a while now and that’s where a lot for the bolts came from.
When we descended the canyon 2 years ago we found many of the bolts as singles. The stations we used, we added second, stainless, placements to. We didn’t pull anything either as we had no idea who placed all the bolts and who might be expecting them. But you are right. A reasonable descent of Canyon of the Dammed probably “requires” about 10 raps.
Fun canyon though. Sati
Ken wrote:
I have used my belay device extended out like that in the past. I > see little difference between extending like this to hang on your > device and hanging on a belay anchor.
Three reasons come to mind: > 1. Increased control of the break hands (both hands can function on > the break side with good strength) > 2. Don’t know proper term here: it is easy to use a Z-pulley > advantage if desired. (clip a locker to a leg loop, clip a locker > close to the belay device, run the rope through the rappel device > through the leg locker, back to the upper locker, to break hand. > Whalla, serious stopping power.) > -Both 1 and 2 are if you have someone using a “do it all” belay > device on 8 mm ropes. > 3. Most of all it can make swimming disconnects easier as the rappel > device is at chest level while floating so you can see it while you > remove it and it is not a mystery under water at your crotch.
Bolts: Passed a one pair above an easy down climb, second pair above > challenging slaby down climb which would be unsafe if the slab was > wet (slab is way out of water course). Two pairs across canyon from > a natrual anchor, appeared to be placed so you’d get that; “I’m bad > ass picture”. The second pair were even set such that you could not > reach them safely without coming from the pair above because they > were across the water course.
Pair of bolts out of view up right, you must assend ledges to reach > them, then connect with lower bolts to right of pool. Or walk over > to the 4 ft diameter tree out of view left and take the 200 ft ride > down. > http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#525371355
pool. Completely unsafe to reach from downcanyon left. > http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#525371360
Ken
I should clarify I’m not a fan of this extended belay device technic if you could encounter an overhang near the start of your rappel; what I refer to as a knuckle grinder. Your sling or daisy chain could be weighted across the edge of rock or dragged agianst the rock and this would put serious wear on your sling which is why I would only recommend this in geology you are familair with for me the Sierras or San Gabriels you are unlikely to encounter knockle grinders like in Utah.
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Ken” wrote:
I have used my belay device extended out like that in the past. I > see little difference between extending like this to hang on your > device and hanging on a belay anchor.
Three reasons come to mind: > 1. Increased control of the break hands (both hands can function on > the break side with good strength) > 2. Don’t know proper term here: it is easy to use a Z-pulley > advantage if desired. (clip a locker to a leg loop, clip a locker > close to the belay device, run the rope through the rappel device > through the leg locker, back to the upper locker, to break hand. > Whalla, serious stopping power.) > -Both 1 and 2 are if you have someone using a “do it all” belay > device on 8 mm ropes. > 3. Most of all it can make swimming disconnects easier as the rappel > device is at chest level while floating so you can see it while you > remove it and it is not a mystery under water at your crotch.
Bolts: Passed a one pair above an easy down climb, second pair above > challenging slaby down climb which would be unsafe if the slab was > wet (slab is way out of water course). Two pairs across canyon from > a natrual anchor, appeared to be placed so you’d get that; “I’m bad > ass picture”. The second pair were even set such that you could not > reach them safely without coming from the pair above because they > were across the water course.
Pair of bolts out of view up right, you must assend ledges to reach > them, then connect with lower bolts to right of pool. Or walk over > to the 4 ft diameter tree out of view left and take the 200 ft ride > down. > http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#525371355
4310052210
In this picture they a pair of bolts are on the far side of the > pool. Completely unsafe to reach from downcanyon left. > http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#525371360
3155995042
I didn’t think any bolts were worth messing with but if you are a > skilled canyoneer who takes the natraul course and does not setup > glamor shot rappels you will probably only find 9 or so rappels; not > 13.
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Tom Jones” wrote:
Thanks for the TR and pictures, Ken.
Beta on the canyon is available here:
http://www.sierracanyons.org/beta/node/43
> I noticed you (or your friend) had the rappel device extended out
quite a ways. I have not seen that before. Does this work for
you? What are the benefits and the deficits?
In what way were the bolts unnecessary? Please expand on this
criticism (and, I don’t mean to be snarky – I’m just looking for
more information and then more opinion).
Tom
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Ken” wrote:
For anyone interested I ran Big Falls Canyon (aka Canyon of the
> Damned) with 2 friends in the Sierra foothills in September.
> Pictures at:
> http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#
> We ran the canyon with 2 x 200 ft ropes in 3 mm farmer jobs with
> neotops and were very comfortable for most of the trip. The
canyon
> took about 7 hours. Fun straight forward canyon with lots of
> unnecessary bolts. While it lacks the splendor of “Lower Jump”
and
> the jumps it also lacks the slog out as the exit is pretty quick
and
> easy. Lots of bang for your buck, easy shuttle, easy approach,
fun
> rappels, good scenery, and easy exit.
Beta note: The “Penstock” which we took to mean giant pipe next > to
> dirt road was repainted so we never found a section marked 250 > but
> if you hike to the gate house at the end of the road you get a
great
> view and easy approach down the forested slope to almost
immediately
> the first rappel.
Cheers!
> Ken
Ken
I have used my belay device extended out like that in the past. I see little difference between extending like this to hang on your device and hanging on a belay anchor.
Three reasons come to mind: 1. Increased control of the break hands (both hands can function on the break side with good strength) 2. Don’t know proper term here: it is easy to use a Z-pulley advantage if desired. (clip a locker to a leg loop, clip a locker close to the belay device, run the rope through the rappel device through the leg locker, back to the upper locker, to break hand. Whalla, serious stopping power.) -Both 1 and 2 are if you have someone using a “do it all” belay device on 8 mm ropes. 3. Most of all it can make swimming disconnects easier as the rappel device is at chest level while floating so you can see it while you remove it and it is not a mystery under water at your crotch.
Bolts: Passed a one pair above an easy down climb, second pair above challenging slaby down climb which would be unsafe if the slab was wet (slab is way out of water course). Two pairs across canyon from a natrual anchor, appeared to be placed so you’d get that; “I’m bad ass picture”. The second pair were even set such that you could not reach them safely without coming from the pair above because they were across the water course.
Pair of bolts out of view up right, you must assend ledges to reach them, then connect with lower bolts to right of pool. Or walk over to the 4 ft diameter tree out of view left and take the 200 ft ride down. http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#525371355 4310052210
In this picture they a pair of bolts are on the far side of the pool. Completely unsafe to reach from downcanyon left. http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#525371360 3155995042
I didn’t think any bolts were worth messing with but if you are a skilled canyoneer who takes the natraul course and does not setup glamor shot rappels you will probably only find 9 or so rappels; not 13.
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Tom Jones” wrote:
Thanks for the TR and pictures, Ken.
Beta on the canyon is available here:
http://www.sierracanyons.org/beta/node/43
> I noticed you (or your friend) had the rappel device extended out > quite a ways. I have not seen that before. Does this work for > you? What are the benefits and the deficits?
In what way were the bolts unnecessary? Please expand on this > criticism (and, I don’t mean to be snarky – I’m just looking for > more information and then more opinion).
Tom
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Ken” wrote:
For anyone interested I ran Big Falls Canyon (aka Canyon of the
Damned) with 2 friends in the Sierra foothills in September.
Pictures at:
http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#
> We ran the canyon with 2 x 200 ft ropes in 3 mm farmer jobs with
neotops and were very comfortable for most of the trip. The > canyon
took about 7 hours. Fun straight forward canyon with lots of
unnecessary bolts. While it lacks the splendor of “Lower Jump” > and
the jumps it also lacks the slog out as the exit is pretty quick > and
easy. Lots of bang for your buck, easy shuttle, easy approach, > fun
rappels, good scenery, and easy exit.
Beta note: The “Penstock” which we took to mean giant pipe next to
dirt road was repainted so we never found a section marked 250 but
if you hike to the gate house at the end of the road you get a > great
view and easy approach down the forested slope to almost > immediately
the first rappel.
Cheers!
Ken
>
Felicia Bicknell
I noticed you (or your friend) had the rappel device > extended out > quite a ways. I have not seen that before. Does this work > for > you? What are the benefits and the deficits? >
> Tom >
I saw this set-up in Pine Creek with the group ahead of us. We debated the reasons for the set-up. They were only extending the rappel device out about 20 inches. I was uncomfortable with the fact that they used a sling from their harness to the rappel device. I’m not sure that I want to hang from a sling. I personally decided that extending the rappel device would not work for me as I have no interest in have my rappel device located near my hair.
Tom Jones
Thanks for the TR and pictures, Ken.
Beta on the canyon is available here:
http://www.sierracanyons.org/beta/node/43
I noticed you (or your friend) had the rappel device extended out quite a ways. I have not seen that before. Does this work for you? What are the benefits and the deficits?
In what way were the bolts unnecessary? Please expand on this criticism (and, I don’t mean to be snarky – I’m just looking for more information and then more opinion).
Tom
— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “Ken” wrote:
For anyone interested I ran Big Falls Canyon (aka Canyon of the > Damned) with 2 friends in the Sierra foothills in September. > Pictures at: > http://picasaweb.google.com/kenhoffman/SierraBigCreekCanyon#
> We ran the canyon with 2 x 200 ft ropes in 3 mm farmer jobs with > neotops and were very comfortable for most of the trip. The canyon > took about 7 hours. Fun straight forward canyon with lots of > unnecessary bolts. While it lacks the splendor of “Lower Jump” and > the jumps it also lacks the slog out as the exit is pretty quick and > easy. Lots of bang for your buck, easy shuttle, easy approach, fun > rappels, good scenery, and easy exit.
Beta note: The “Penstock” which we took to mean giant pipe next to > dirt road was repainted so we never found a section marked 250 but > if you hike to the gate house at the end of the road you get a great > view and easy approach down the forested slope to almost immediately > the first rappel.
Cheers! > Ken >