~TR – Pandora”s another one

— In Yahoo Canyons Group, Jeff Dredge wrote:

>>That was a very fun read. Enjoyed it a bunch. It is a classic canyon. No> Jeff? Some responsibility loom its ugly head again???

> Ram! Are you talking about my ugly head again!? See if I let you use that> ugly thing as a step ladder to get out of a pothole again.

See Jeff, there is that self esteem thing again rearing it ugly head. Does anyone know if he is joking or not? Its sooooo hard on the net to tell ;-). And that threat about not allowing us to step on you, as you toss us out of potholes????? Dude, that is part of your self definition! To hedge my bets, I bring you to places unknown, don’t bring maps or tell where we are headed. That way everyone is vested in my safe passage.

> Yea it was wonderful. I actually was the one that planned the trip. Seems> like the great American was was to own your own business so that you could> have all the time off that you want. Seems to me that you are the only one> I know to actually make that theory work.

It just requires a wife who loves to have you away and the willingness to leave your business in state of benevolent neglect. That and being willing to make 1/3 of the money you could. One of the byproducts is the fine fashion statements I make. I am a holey man. R

> On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 1:04 PM, orsdoc wrote:

> I probably should proof this before posting but here it is

On 28 March 09 Jacen Wray, Mack Wray, Jason Carlson, Randy Willis and I

went down Pandora’s. It was the first trip for all of us. Ten days ago we

had a group over twice this size but work, health, and weather concerns

caused a lot of cancellations. The canyon has been on my tick list for years

but for some reason I have never gotten around to it. My loss, this is one

good canyon. We drove in Friday evening and camped out at the Days Inn. A

cold wind blew most the night and in the morning it was still cold and

blowing at the Days Inn but it wasn’t bad at the trailhead. There were two

vehicles parked nearby. A truck with a camper and a van are parked by the

trailhead. We had intended to start at 7 but left the cars just before 8 AM.

The wind was blowing again on the ridge hike up but once we got to the bench

it calmed down. The sun eventually came out and there wasn’t a cloud in the

sky. What a wonderful day it was.

We found our way to the North Fork and there was a couple there getting

ready to start the canyon. They were nice folk and we chatted for a bit

before they took off and we put on our gear. She was a little tentative on

the down-climb but he was helping her. They had two and we had five so I

figured separation would soon occur. I was really impressed with the canyon.

It has a little of everything and is so beautiful. As we worked the sun got

warmer more clothes came off and were placed in the pack.

We finished the rappels and started the narrows section. This was the very

narrows section that I had read just the week before that a 195 pound

canyoneer had been through at ground level. The start looked too tight for

me so I went high. That is were we and came across the couple again. She was

in the middle and not moving and he was at the end. When we got to her we

learned that he was at the end with a badly twisted ankle and she was wedged

firmly in and couldn’t move. She told us that she would be ok and we should

just go on. He would come back and help her. Yeah, right, five guys are just

going to head down the canyon and leave this couple one of them stuck and

the other disabled to deal with their problems on their own.

It looked like if she could just get a little further down canyon she it

would widen. I established a position above her and edged down canyon a bit.

Jason positioned just down canyon and Jacen was just up canyon. And we had

another just up canyon. I lowered my daisy chain and she pulled. And we

pulled, tugged, pushed etc but to no avail. Now she said she was having

trouble getting a breath. Ok, if moving her down canyon didn’t help maybe we

should try up-canyon. More squirming, pulling, relaxing, and working it and

she was able to move an inch, then six inches, then a foot. It was wider

here and she could relax for a bit. Now she needed to come up. She couldn’t

get any footing and was pretty tired by then. We had a branch to push off on

but it wasn’t helping. Randy chimneyed above me and we fastened several of

our daisy chains together which she grabbed onto and Randy took from his

perch. I got the one attached to her harness and we heaved. First a foot,

then two and finally she was high and free!

We got to the canyon opens just a bit before closing for another very short

narrows before opening once again. Her partner was moving very slowly with a

swollen ankle and he could hobble. I hope it isn’t broken because he needs

to hobble out of there. They say that they will be ok and encourage us to go

on. So we climb through this very short section and settle down for lunch

while we watch. I did notice that to the right LUC is a rockfall. I wonder

if that goes to the top and is the 4th class exit that Matt talked about on

the canyons group earlier in the week. I wish that I knew for sure. It

seemed like it would go. Ater a long time the couple finally made it

through. They tell us to go on and that they will be ok. I ask them if they

know about the exit coming up. From their puzzled looks I explain that I

have a write up by Ryan Cornia that says an exit is coming right up. They

should take it. I explained that I don’t know Ryan but his beta that I have

followed has always been accurate and Jacen knows him. We have every reason

to assume that this exit will go as advertised and I don’t think that they

are in any condition to complete the canyon and get out. I pull out the beta

and give it to him. He reads it and says ok and gives it back. I said “Oh

no, we will do fine, you take the route description” and hand it back to

them. We then went down to the junction with the south fork, down to the log

filled slot, back up to the exit route, found the dryfall and started them

on their way.

OK, gang it is down the canyon! What a canyon it is too. It has a bit of

everything. The lighting is fantastic. The sky is blue. The weather is

perfect. No water to deal with. What more could one ask for. The hard

feature of this canyon is the awkward starts to many down climbs. The canyon

pinches right at the start of the down-climb forcing one to go up and over

and then it is very difficult to hold the lip or anything else to ease

oneself down. After trying several different methods the method of choice

became one person would go high and wedge in then drop a line for the first

person down. He could then rap it or use it as a hand line. Once he was down

it became easy. I’ve been (and still am) a student of the Ram school of

canyoneering. Thigh belays and pushing the person into the rock as they

slide down works great to control their descent. The rappels usually had

awkward starts and that was a concern for Jacen’s 14 year old son Mack.

There are two approaches here. We could always give him a body belay to make

it quicker or we could let him struggle a bit and figure out the starts.

Well, he is Jacen’s son so we let him struggle and watched as he improved.

We made it to the finish and make it down. That one we did send a number of

the group down from an anchor with an easier start. As the last one down I’m

doing my usual fiddling with the rope as I reset it and make sure the pull

will go well. I hear from down below a very concerned voice “are you sure

he’s ok up there Dad?” It was nice knowing someone was concerned because his

dad answered “he’s done it a thousand of times, don’t worry.”

We hiked up canyon, up to the top of Meeks Mesa and down. At the bench at

the bottom of the final climb to the mesa we find our lass no longer in

distress but sitting on a rock with no partner in sight. It turns out that

they made it this far and his ankle was killing him. She went ahead to drop

her pack and return and carry his to the truck but couldn’t find him. She

returned with us to the truck where he was waiting. It is just after six PM.

> >

— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “orsdoc” wrote:

— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “adkramoo” wrote:

> Jeff wears many hats but he is an accountant and tax season is drawing to a close. Working is a pain but it does have it’s merits including insurance and pay that allows us to go canyoneering. Or it could be that he just broke out in a cold sweat when I said let’s to another skinny canyon and this was his way out.

Ummm possible. Ask him to a skinny one in late April and see if he doesn’t use “late filing extentions” as an excuse. Hi Jeff, love ya! 😉

> If I get it right, she was frozen on the high stem, he was just beyond it hurt?

>>She was stemming but not very high. Or shall I say not high enough.

Oh so she was doing that “middle ground” thing, that while not as exposed, is way more physical. Ummm. Interesting that the guy abandoned her. He hurt himself there or earlier, I wonder

> What would have happened had you not been there?

>>It was fortuitous for them and fun for us. I liked the fact that we were able to help out and it was a bit of a challenge and it is fun.

Remind me if i get in trouble to have you around. I’ll show you a great time 😉

> Showing them the escape was lucky for them too.

>>If it hadn’t happened right when it did we would have helped them through the canyon and then all the way out. We all would have been out all night. So yes very lucky.

Yes all night for sure. Much of the area is above 7,000 feet. Would not have been fun. Were they a young couple? Get any sense of their experience? Would they have been OK if the man hadn’t hurt himself?

>> Also lucky that Ryan mentioned the escape route. I wouldn’t have known if one could get out from there without the beta. I saw the rocks going up and thought about that but in a case like this I’ll take the sure way out.

Without the certainty, you would likely have exited with them, is my guess. Ryan saved your day, in a way.

> AND you still caught up with them?

>>We weren’t exactly fast. Ten hours round trip and I was relieved to see them.

10 hours is just fine time for that canyon. Most take longer. Funny how they lost each other again. I wonder how they are getting along? 😉 There is a relationship tester. LOL! R

That was a very fun read. Enjoyed it a bunch. It is a classic canyon. No Jeff? Some responsibility loom its ugly head again???

It was rather disturbing to hear about that other group in there. You totally saved their bacon(Where does that one come from?). If I get it right, she was frozen on the high stem, he was just beyond it hurt? What would have happened had you not been there? Showing them the escape was lucky for them too. AND you still caught up with them? If they had gone all the way through the place and then either of the exits, it sounds like it would have been iffy that they get out before a 2nd bivouac!! I wonder from where they got the information on the place? Anyone know? Mr. Lewis? 😉

Anyway, pretty disturbing. I wonder what would have happened if they hadn’t had you around. kudos for the help rendered. R

— In Yahoo Canyons Group, “orsdoc” wrote:

I probably should proof this before posting but here it is

On 28 March 09 Jacen Wray, Mack Wray, Jason Carlson, Randy Willis and I went down Pandora’s. It was the first trip for all of us. Ten days ago we had a group over twice this size but work, health, and weather concerns caused a lot of cancellations. The canyon has been on my tick list for years but for some reason I have never gotten around to it. My loss, this is one good canyon. We drove in Friday evening and camped out at the Days Inn. A cold wind blew most the night and in the morning it was still cold and blowing at the Days Inn but it wasn’t bad at the trailhead. There were two vehicles parked nearby. A truck with a camper and a van are parked by the trailhead. We had intended to start at 7 but left the cars just before 8 AM. The wind was blowing again on the ridge hike up but once we got to the bench it calmed down. The sun eventually came out and there wasn’t a cloud in the sky. What a wonderful day it was.

We found our way to the North Fork and there was a couple there getting ready to start the canyon. They were nice folk and we chatted for a bit before they took off and we put on our gear. She was a little tentative on the down-climb but he was helping her. They had two and we had five so I figured separation would soon occur. I was really impressed with the canyon. It has a little of everything and is so beautiful. As we worked the sun got warmer more clothes came off and were placed in the pack.

We finished the rappels and started the narrows section. This was the very narrows section that I had read just the week before that a 195 pound canyoneer had been through at ground level. The start looked too tight for me so I went high. That is were we and came across the couple again. She was in the middle and not moving and he was at the end. When we got to her we learned that he was at the end with a badly twisted ankle and she was wedged firmly in and couldn’t move. She told us that she would be ok and we should just go on. He would come back and help her. Yeah, right, five guys are just going to head down the canyon and leave this couple one of them stuck and the other disabled to deal with their problems on their own.

It looked like if she could just get a little further down canyon she it would widen. I established a position above her and edged down canyon a bit. Jason positioned just down canyon and Jacen was just up canyon. And we had another just up canyon. I lowered my daisy chain and she pulled. And we pulled, tugged, pushed etc but to no avail. Now she said she was having trouble getting a breath. Ok, if moving her down canyon didn’t help maybe we should try up-canyon. More squirming, pulling, relaxing, and working it and she was able to move an inch, then six inches, then a foot. It was wider here and she could relax for a bit. Now she needed to come up. She couldn’t get any footing and was pretty tired by then. We had a branch to push off on but it wasn’t helping. Randy chimneyed above me and we fastened several of our daisy chains together which she grabbed onto and Randy took from his perch. I got the one attached to her harness and we heaved. First a foot, then two and finally she was high and free!

We got to the canyon opens just a bit before closing for another very short narrows before opening once again. Her partner was moving very slowly with a swollen ankle and he could hobble. I hope it isn’t broken because he needs to hobble out of there. They say that they will be ok and encourage us to go on. So we climb through this very short section and settle down for lunch while we watch. I did notice that to the right LUC is a rockfall. I wonder if that goes to the top and is the 4th class exit that Matt talked about on the canyons group earlier in the week. I wish that I knew for sure. It seemed like it would go. Ater a long time the couple finally made it through. They tell us to go on and that they will be ok. I ask them if they know about the exit coming up. From their puzzled looks I explain that I have a write up by Ryan Cornia that says an exit is coming right up. They should take it. I explained that I don’t know Ryan but his beta that I have followed has always been accurate and Jacen knows him. We have every reason to assume that this exit will go as advertised and I don’t think that they are in any condition to complete the canyon and get out. I pull out the beta and give it to him. He reads it and says ok and gives it back. I said “Oh no, we will do fine, you take the route description” and hand it back to them. We then went down to the junction with the south fork, down to the log filled slot, back up to the exit route, found the dryfall and started them on their way.

OK, gang it is down the canyon! What a canyon it is too. It has a bit of everything. The lighting is fantastic. The sky is blue. The weather is perfect. No water to deal with. What more could one ask for. The hard feature of this canyon is the awkward starts to many down climbs. The canyon pinches right at the start of the down-climb forcing one to go up and over and then it is very difficult to hold the lip or anything else to ease oneself down. After trying several different methods the method of choice became one person would go high and wedge in then drop a line for the first person down. He could then rap it or use it as a hand line. Once he was down it became easy. I’ve been (and still am) a student of the Ram school of canyoneering. Thigh belays and pushing the person into the rock as they slide down works great to control their descent. The rappels usually had awkward starts and that was a concern for Jacen’s 14 year old son Mack. There are two approaches here. We could always give him a body belay to make it quicker or we could let him struggle a bit and figure out the starts. Well, he is Jacen’s son so we let him struggle and watched as he improved.

We made it to the finish and make it down. That one we did send a number of the group down from an anchor with an easier start. As the last one down I’m doing my usual fiddling with the rope as I reset it and make sure the pull will go well. I hear from down below a very concerned voice “are you sure he’s ok up there Dad?” It was nice knowing someone was concerned because his dad answered “he’s done it a thousand of times, don’t worry.”

We hiked up canyon, up to the top of Meeks Mesa and down. At the bench at the bottom of the final climb to the mesa we find our lass no longer in distress but sitting on a rock with no partner in sight. It turns out that they made it this far and his ankle was killing him. She went ahead to drop her pack and return and carry his to the truck but couldn’t find him. She returned with us to the truck where he was waiting. It is just after six PM. >